Gimme That Old Time Religion!
I dunno, it just seems like a relevant clip. Is this one reason why they came up with that whole separation of church & state concept?
On a side note, I ran into a friend this morning at a local cafe who, in a very brilliant Libertarian moment, said,
" The No on Prop 8 people are fighting the wrong battle. Instead of fighting for the rights of the gay & lesbian community to marry, they should be fighting to have every union between anyone, including a man & a woman, simply function as a legal civil union. Get the government out of the wedding business completely! If the couple wants to take the extra step of labeling their civil union a marriage, then they can go to the church of their choosing and make it so according to the beliefs and traditions of that particular religion. What's so hard about that?"
It seemed like a good idea to me, but I was only on my first cup of coffee, so what do I know?
On a side note, I ran into a friend this morning at a local cafe who, in a very brilliant Libertarian moment, said,
" The No on Prop 8 people are fighting the wrong battle. Instead of fighting for the rights of the gay & lesbian community to marry, they should be fighting to have every union between anyone, including a man & a woman, simply function as a legal civil union. Get the government out of the wedding business completely! If the couple wants to take the extra step of labeling their civil union a marriage, then they can go to the church of their choosing and make it so according to the beliefs and traditions of that particular religion. What's so hard about that?"
It seemed like a good idea to me, but I was only on my first cup of coffee, so what do I know?
Labels: church and state, No On Prop 8, prop 8
Posted by Unknown @ 11/09/2008 11:31:00 PM
11 Comments:
Hmmm, not really sure what your point here is with this video Joe. This is an ancient battle between Armenians and Greeks, who are the same religion, but from different hoods. Its more of a bloods and crip thing, about territory, than religion.
Even though these folks are not acting Christian, not all Christians are like this.
On the other hand the idea about civil unions I think is really the way to go and I hope there is a ballot measure being prepared for this.
My point was/is WTF are they fighting about? And to your point,
why are they still fighting about something that really means nothing more than placement of their colors?
And these are the leaders of the church? Just silly, no matter how serious they try to make it. Kinda like Prop 8.
Yea, a Civil Unions for All measure
is the way to go. The gov't has no business interpreting "God's Work".
Yea but it's not really a religious battle as it's more ethnic. Anyway these are old goofy farts. Remember a lot of churches supported NO on Prop 8; it was just that some of the ones like the Mormons, the Catholics and the Evangelicals have a lot of money.
By the way Joe, Jack Hoff likes our late night debates. But this is all for now, I have to go to bed.
I share your Libertarian ideal of taking the word marriage out of the government vernacular. In fact, I was banned from the local Dem blog The Liberal OC for that very position. I was told that I was spreading 'misinformation' because I felt that government should remove itself from the marriage business.
However, as long as they are still in the biz, the law must be applied equally. This fight for gay marriage only started because religious leaders want to keep control of CIVIL marriage and by extension, a certain extent of control over the culture war.
The conundrum for me is in reconciling the need for equality with the fact that gay marriage actually strengthens the religious concept's power by increasing the number of people involved.
If you really want to strengthen marriage, ban divorce. Otherwise, the most equitable solution is to remove the word 'marriage' from the law entirely. Additional laws to ban gay marriage make government larger, not smaller.
SMS
MS, Got it. Religious ethnic old fart silliness.
And a big hello to Mr Hoff as he hangs out with the beautiful people
in DC.
I've actually said that for some years. The answer is that any two adults who want to get married can go into a contract with each other and record it at the county. Then, that's the person you designate for your insurance, next of kin, etc.
Of course even with legal gay marriage gay couples can't get their deceased spouses Social Security. That's a whole other issue.
The whole argument too about forcing churches to do gay marriage is a joke. Churches, temples, etc. turn people down all the time whether it's Catholic churches turning down divorced people or clergy members who turn down people they feel aren't ready to get married.
I'm glad to see Jack up late doing his thing too!
SMS, I defer to your opinion. You're living the debate and have much more
experience to draw upon in this issue.
Civil Unions For All still seems like a good compromise, and everyone gets what they want, goes home equal in the eyes of the law, AND they can still get married if they choose.
When the people speak, why not accept their vedict? This is America; majority still rules.
How much longer will this issue last when there is no court of last resort?
The People (with a capital "P") are the deciders; they have decided.
Live with it.
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